What began as a quest to photograph the other, the excluded and the marginalized, quickly became a form of political activism for Herberto Smith. It is through photography that he seeks to put the fringes of society, those without access to the city, on the map, by portraying them in a way he says is not to be found in traditional media. In them he seeks the purity and essence of being human, exposing the experience of what it is to be black in Lisbon. Because he argues that racism not only exists, but it is embedded in Portuguese society, through an attitude of the "good colonizer" that has been perpetuated to this day.
Now living in the Alentejo, Herberto Smith explains that the photo sessions lost their spontaneity and began to be more thought-out and planned. On the other hand, his work as a political activist began to grow as a facilitator, as one who finds opportunities for young black people, even as they fail to find meaning at this time. But Smith doesn’t give up, and he increasingly feels that this is the way forward, as he says, "there's still more to do."
The next step is to take to Lisbon the two brothers behind the project Favela Institute of Peace, Brazil. Herberto Smith was in Macau recently, where his series of 80 portraits is part of the "Alter Ego" exhibition, part of the Annual Exhibition of Arts between China and Portuguese Language Countries. In an interview with our sister publication, Ponto Final, the activist photographer explained the concept that drives his entire body of work and that compels him, on a daily basis, to break the prejudices and stereotypes that still surround the black community in Portugal. Smith's faces, which together form his "family album", can be seen until September 9 at the Macao Museum of Art.
His photographic series presented in "The Self", is an integral part of the "Alter Ego" exhibition. The photographer explains how he started by mapping the exclusion of the urban area.
I lived in Lisbon for some time and lived in some of the peripheral areas. I lived in Queluz, in Miratejo, in Odivelas, and at the time I was a student, I had no idea what these places could represent as a periphery of the centre. Then there was a period when I was living in downtown Lisbon, I worked in the fashion world, I had experiences in the theater, I worked in Bairro Alto and I had access to the centre and the most restricted nucleus. Then I left Lisbon, spending five years in Águeda, and when I returned to Lisbon I saw that things had changed immensely and I began to mainly identify with young black people. The fact that I had been away, in a place where I did not see many black people, made me think, "So many new people, so many beautiful people, how come I do not see these people on television and in the press?" I also realized that there was a certain pattern in the people who started to interest me. They were people who were part of this invisible Lisbon and, in that sense, they are people who are, to a certain extent, excluded.
And what was that pattern?
These are things that, to me, are easy to identify because there is a code in the way people dress, how they move, how they present themselves. Young black people, many of them with dreadlocks, with a more urban style, are always in tracksuits, trainers, with bags. There were codes I could identify and many of these people were part of this excluded Lisbon. There was this impulse because they are people I knew less about, and who also belong to this universe of people who only appeared in the press when something bad happened. So there was this urge to start identifying where those excluded people are and I started to develop that relationship from there.
You say that, with this work, you try to portray the most marginalized fringes of society. In this sense, does the dimension in which the images are presented also contribute to this effect, in order to create closer approximation between the portrayed and the public?
Yes, it was on purpose. For me, the most important thing was to pass that energy, that emotion and what it is to be close to the other. At the same time, to be deprived, to not be pretentious because my relationship with them is exactly the same. I do not want these images to be a trophy and when I have these experiences I'm not thinking "Wow, these pictures will make a good exhibition." I just think, "Wow, this situation is incredible, I'm going to find the most poetic way I can to pass this on to others and to break down fears, break stereotypes," and that's what I try to do. Often those spaces can be viewed in a completely different way or people can be photographed in a completely different way. The most difficult thing is to find poetry and beauty in it. That's what I try to do.
And what stereotypes and prejudices do you seek to break?
Prejudices about what is marginal, what is black. There are a number of stereotypes we know of that are associated with black people, of being poor, of these young people being linked to the life of criminality. Just on that I think there is a lot to work to do and a lot to discuss. It is my job, too, because I too have my preconceived ideas, whether in relation to my own community or to the other. It’s enough to just be the other, to be unknown to create the temptation to simplify and catalog, and this is always reductive.
Is it this border between the self and others that you seek to dilute?
Yes, yes. At the same time it is a spiritual work because this is a path that I have been on and I feel this need to return to being human. With technology and social networks people are increasingly losing this human dimension and believing in technology much more. I think we have to go the other way. What started as a photograph of those people, who are different, who I wanted to discover, as I got closer and became intimate, turned into photographs of myself. I can see myself in others and things evolved to the point of generating greater empathy and sense of belonging. The closer we get to others, we get to live in those people and become part of a family.
In your body of work you mainly present young faces. Why this trend?
During this journey, I’ve been more connected to activist movements and I began to realize that in these encounters, there is discussion of these issues, but I feel that there is a lack of rapprochement. To me, it is not very effective to talk about racism, to talk about police violence, without realizing how these things happen. If these messages are not passed on to these young people, if they are only discussed by the activists, these things are likely to continue or be repeated. If there is such an approximation and if there is such a translation while we are with these young people and explain why these things happen, what measures they can take, what support they can get, I think this is far more effective than only discussing it from the psychological, academic or political point of view.
For a young black person, the experience they have going anywhere, for example, being in a group and suddenly feeling that they are being watched. On the train and the inspector is always putting more pressure on them and the experience turns out to be a very visceral thing and, intellectually, it is not articulated. If a youngster knows of the support they can have and can understand, even from a psychological point of view, what causes these fears to take hold – it doesn’t mean that he has to stop being what he is – they can manage to work with that. If it is addressed, even for physical protection, it is better able to maintain a dialogue, to avoid situations of greater tension or conflict.
Does the other side also need to be addressed?
Without a doubt. These activist associations are already doing their part, but it is such an ingrained and deep issue that there is a long way to go. It is a structural issue and a matter of privilege, because people do not realize why they are racist and fail to see themselves as racist, in most cases. I have no doubt that this work needs to be done and the fact that I photograph, for that particular case, only black people, is a 'statement'. It is also a matter of familiarization, of people being exposed to things and getting used to them. This is a personal project, but as a professional work, I am an editorial photographer, I also do publicity, corporate work and internal communication for some important companies and I move in that space. The fact that I am present is as if I were representing some people who have the same characteristics as me. It is a very conscious thing but the question that you raise is the same, you also have to work with people who are racist, no doubt. I think most of the work should be done on that side. I still do not know how to do it, I'm still figuring it out.
In the series with artists from the world of rap and hip-hop, was there also an attempt to deconstruct the image with which they usually perform in public?
In hip-hop and rap there is a language and, most of the time, these languages are imported from the United States or from France, and there is always a tendency to appear as tough, and ostentatious and that does not interest me. When I make the first outline, I make the images they want but then I look for an image for myself, I look for that more human dimension, more fragile, more vulnerable and it is this space that I want to occupy. I am more interested in the interior than the exterior. Gradually I achieve this because they then begin to realize that I, with my images, can put them in another space. They are beginning to realize that what I am doing is of some value and I am passing on this message.
You said that you end up creating close relations with your subjects. Is that why you call the final work your family album?
It is something I am discovering because it is a work in progress and therein lays the difficulty. It is completing this series when I know I still have to continue, because my work is not photography itself. It is a job of building relationships, building affections and this will not stop. I will continue to feel that, with my experience, I may have something to share with others.
Is it a project that will never be completed?
I don’t think so. Now, since I live in the Alentejo, it has to be more programmed and has to be more thought out. Maybe it can take other directions, but what is happening at the moment is that I have photographed less but, at the same time, I have increased my activity as a facilitator, as a networker and as someone who creates connections, someone who can have access. I have been collaborating with HANGAR [Artistic Research Center] and have been able to create and identify opportunities for some people. Of course, they often do not realize the potential that things can have, they have other concerns, but I try.
Your work seeks to “put people from these marginalized areas on the map" and you say that in Lisbon we see black people, but we do not know where they live because they do not have access to the city. What did you mean by that?
For example, a foreigner who comes to Lisbon can identify it as a city that has a black or African presence but, just in passing, they cannot understand where these people are. Even if you travel through the city you will hardly have access to the neighbourhoods and places where those people live. Many of these people only come to town when they have to work. Black women, usually older, only come to town because they have to work in offices and in houses to do cleaning. Young people also no longer engage in shows, play activities or even more interventional activities because it is expensive to leave the area where they are to come to the city, and people do not have that notion. It is very expensive and if they do not have a pass it is very expensive to leave to occupy the space of the city that is also theirs.
Do you see an increase in the representation of the black community in the media?
What I notice is that there is a crescendo of awareness of our condition. There are more groups and associations, there is more claim for rights and this I think is happening. Probably, with some cases of police violence and racism occurring, people turn out to be more demanding and more interventionist. This is what I feel right now, but there is a lot of work to do. I think that everything is still to be done.
It is often said that Portugal is not a racist country, but then there are situations like the aggression toward the young Colombian woman on the night of Porto. For you, is it self-deception or, as you mentioned earlier, that people do not have the perception that they are racist?
People do not accept themselves because, deep down, this is also a constructed image. This question of Luso-tropicalism because, in the end, there was an intentional campaign to try to create the image of the Portuguese as good colonizers and people have it embedded and think that "we were in Africa, we even blended with them, therefore we are not racist". But then just take any given situation. It's a very simple question, you'll see Facebook comments and you'll see the things people say.
Do you feel that this image of the good colonizer has been perpetuated into the 21st century?
Yes, no doubt. This paternalistic view continues. There's no doubt.
For you, what role does the black community represent in the media? Does this matter more than representativeness, in terms of numbers?
No doubt. This I think ends up being a bit intentional because I believe people, if they had to let their human and empathetic part speak, feel that we are equal and that we deserve the same rights, but it is also a matter of privilege and fears. To understand that this guy has potential, but comes from outside. Portugal is a country of whites, they come first. It is these thoughts that emerge, and end up affecting everything.
In this sense, has the project AfroLis Radio, in which you are involved, also helped play its part in breaking stereotypes?
One of the most important roles is for us to learn to tell our own story. Since the press is not interested in knowing a bit more about the black community and meeting a black artist, a black creative, we try to talk about ourselves and catalog it and create a file. This is important because if these things are not recorded it is as if they did not exist. The truth is that they exist and they happen. However small this gesture may be, after a while it will have a great value, even if it is just a file. I imagine that in the past there were some equally interesting things happening, but they were not recorded so it's as if they did not exist.
Do you create an archive so that the young people from the black community can also feel represented?
And create a space of trust where people feel they can talk.
Your discovery of photography was facing the camera as a model. How did the shift to the other side happen?
In the background, I had a fascination with photography since I was a kid. I remember my father had a camera and some negatives and, to me, it was a magical thing. I tried to figure out how it worked but he would not let me use it. It was already embedded in me. After I entered college, I started working and bought my first camera and things began to develop from there. I started to experiment and to have worked as a model also allowed me to have access to the world of fashion, to work as an assistant and things developed from there. It was a matter of access, because in São Tomé I had no access to things. If I had had access, things would probably have started sooner.
What projects are you working on now?
Projects related to education and training. With HANGAR I have had these collaborations and probably next month I have a project that will involve people who come from Brazil and live in a favela. They will be in Portugal to do training and give lectures and I will try to have a week with them and visit some spaces. I would like to have this exchange of experiences because they are people with a lot of experience and come from a more hostile environment than Lisbon, but have done much more as a community. I wish this exchange of experiences could work as a trigger for these young people to realize that these people live in these conditions but they help each other and believe in the good. If that happens, I think it's going to be something that will spark other things in the very near future.
What work do they do?
They are two brothers, musicians [responsible for the project Favela Institute of Peace] and the favela where they live was considered by the UN one of the most dangerous districts in the world. Through music they managed to break barriers between slums and gangs and today live a community life. There are five families who live in the same space, share the same kitchen, have managed to set up a publishing house, have equipment to set up shows, the favela artists go there to record the records, believe in a sharing economy, nobody is in charge and everything they make is shared. They have travelled through Europe, Germany, Switzerland, will give lectures and collect that money to share. It's almost like a case study. Of course there are theories about sharing or gifting economies and there are people who already live that without articulating it intellectually. It is an experience that is lived and it is this experience that I would like to see happening in the districts of Lisbon.
